Patriotic Alliance (PA) President Gayton McKenzie has declared all-out war on the Democratic Alliance (DA) after his recent olive branch to the opposition party “expired”. Speaking to BizNews after another two by-election victories, he says: “It’s war. It’s full-out war. We are not playing. I extended the olive branch because I do think that the Western Cape will not be best served with the ANC (African National Congress) coming back…And they then answered that by insulting me…” McKenzie says the PA has been winning 80% of the by-elections it has fought, and he doesn’t think the DA will get 35 per cent of the vote in the Western Cape. Meanwhile, he says Economic Freedom Fighter (EFF) leader Julius Malema understands that the upcoming election is a match between the EFF and the PA. “So I’m saying that if you are a white person, it’s no longer time to vote for your normal parties… Let’s keep Malema out. I’m the only guy that can stand up to that fool. I’m the only one that can stand up to that mafia. South Africa doesn’t deserve a guy like Malema.”
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Summary of the interview with Gayton McKenzie
Gayton McKenzie, President of the Patriotic Alliance, discusses recent by-election victories with Chris Steyn. In the interview, McKenzie highlights the PA’s success in securing two wards in Oudtshoorn and Swartland, as well as nearly claiming a third in Clanwilliam. He emphasizes the PA’s commitment to challenging both the DA and ANC, particularly in areas where the ANC traditionally dominates.
Regarding accusations of PA involvement in encouraging voters to support the ANC in Pearston, McKenzie dismisses them as baseless, asserting the PA’s lack of presence and interest in the area. He criticizes the DA for resorting to false accusations and divisive tactics, including promoting negative remarks by Julius Malema against him.
McKenzie extended an olive branch to the DA, hoping for cooperation to benefit the Western Cape. However, he expresses frustration at the DA’s refusal to engage positively, leading to a declaration of war against them.
He discusses the PA’s electoral successes, claiming 29 councillors in the Western Cape and highlighting their growth and performance in by-elections. McKenzie predicts the decline of the DA’s support in the Western Cape due to perceived neglect of non-white communities, emphasizing the importance of service delivery.
Regarding national elections, he predicts shifts in support for various parties, with the EFF, ActionSA, and Freedom Front Plus gaining momentum. He suggests potential coalition scenarios and stresses the need for parties to prioritize property rights and socioeconomic issues.
McKenzie also addresses his efforts to broker peace among gangs in Malmesbury, acknowledging the root causes of gangsterism and the necessity for socioeconomic intervention.
Ultimately, the PA President calls for a new approach to governance in the Western Cape, advocating for the recruitment of capable individuals regardless of party affiliation to address pressing challenges.
Extended transcript of the interview ___STEADY_PAYWALL___
Chris Steyn (00:01.837)
The Patriotic Alliance has taken two more wards in the Cape. We speak to its President, Gayton McKenzie. Welcome, Gayton.
Gayton (00:10.379)
Thank you very much. Thanks for inviting me always. It’s always a pleasure to be on your show, Chris.
Chris Steyn (00:16.013)
Thank you for stopping the campaign car to spend a few minutes with us. Please take us through the voting tallies in those two by-elections, Oudsthoorn and Swartland.
Gayton (00:18.816)
Yeah
Gayton (00:31.202)
Well, we had three by elections on the night. We had Oudtshoorn, we had Swartland, and we had Clanwilliam. In Clanwilliam, we came a very close second. The party called Cederberg Eerste, the DA, the Freedom Front Plus, supported Cederburg Eerste. And I think they beat us with less than 100 votes in Clanwilliam. But we beat the ANC there, and we came second. In Swartland, which is like the strongest place, the DA is unbeatable in Swartland. We’ve taken that ward from them. We have beaten them with around, I think, 25 to 30 votes to take that ward. And in Dysselsdorp, for the first time, we were so shocked the DA didn’t put a candidate because they said the ANC is too strong there. And we know the ANC is strong there, very strong. The DA was not telling untruth. The ANC is unbeatable there. But we said we’re not going to let them have a free rein. We’re going to fight the ANC. We managed to beat them. We got double, more than double what they got. They got around 600 votes. We got around, we won by 1,200 votes.
So we took all, took two, and we nearly took one again. So we nearly got three.
Chris Steyn (01:58.233)
Okay, over to Pearston where you didn’t field a candidate, but got accused by the Democratic Alliance of encouraging voters to vote for the African National Congress. What happened there, Gayton?
Gayton (02:09.762)
You know, it’s so funny. We never had any intention of…the strategy of the PA is we decide where we’re gonna have by-elections. There was, I think, 11 by-elections around the country. And we never, we’re not strong in Pearston. We don’t really have a big presence in Pearston. So we just look at it and we said, we’re not gonna be partaking there.
So the DA accused us of everything. I mean like, everything under the sun. Why would we do it in Pearston and not on the other seven or eight? The DA is hiding the fact that they were the ones in Dysselsdorp telling people not to vote for the PA and rather vote for the ANC. We beat them with the DA, with the ANC. The DA is hiding the fact that in Swartland, in Clanwilliam, they didn’t put a candidate. They were basically running the show for the Cederburg Eerste. Why would we? We’re not scared of the DA. We’ll come out and say, we don’t owe them nothing. So if we told people…we will never tell our people before an election year, election month, tell them to vote for the ANC. Do you know that thing will bite me? It will haunt us. It will take one PA person to come out and say, oh yeah, you gave us instructions to vote for the ANC. I don’t even know who the ANC’s candidate was. I don’t even know who the DA’s candidate was. I had nothing to do with that. We were laser focused on winning this by-elections. Why would we worry about what happens in Pearston? We beat the ANC. Imagine the DA didn’t put a candidate in Dysselsdorp. I wanna show you how ridiculous their lies. They don’t put a candidate because we all know the ANC’s strong there. But we said, we can’t start something where the ANC just works freely. Somebody must challenge them. And the DA wasn’t willing to do that. And we went. And we won. Imagine I’m telling our people, yeah, let’s finish the ANC and another by-election, I say, help ANC. Who will follow a man like that? It’s ridiculous. It’s a lie. The DA is throwing everything. I mean, the worst thing. I never thought they’ll go to this level. The DA took outan advert, there’s something called, they call it Constitutional Hill or something like that. It’s a DA account – and they took out the advert on Facebook where they were promoting, where Malema insulted me. Now you…that’s when we know they finished. To go to the depths of taking a fool like Malema and say, look what Malema says about Gayton. Malema can say what he likes about Gayton. That guy is just a criminal, a mafia in politics, let me tell you, he’s a mafia. Now the DA is now advertising, paying through account that always promote the DA.
Oh, one of the DAs, the face of the attack against the PA is one lady, a Coloured lady. She’s in all the adverts. She goes like, look what Malema says. You got to listen to what Malema says about Gayton. Since when is Malema authority on anything? That’s how low the DA has gone in the fight with me. That the chief, chief marketing lady that attacks me all the time, that Helen Zelle is retweeting, is now using Malema to attack me. Malema can go to hell. I don’t like Malema, and I’m going to make sure that Malema doesn’t play any role in 2024. I will make damn sure of that. So the DA can use now Malema to attack and advertise his attacks on me. That’s not a problem for me. We have beaten them. We’ve beaten the ANC. We’ve given the ANC a bigger hiding than what we’ve given the DA this past by-elections.
Chris Steyn (06:03.649)
Well, you extended an olive branch to the Democratic Alliance recently, but judging from the friction at the moment, they haven’t taken that branch, Gayton.
Gayton (06:13.806)
No, not only, you know, not only they’ve put me in big trouble in my party because not only have they not taken the olive branch, the day when I gave the olive branch, they took out a range of interviews. They made the range of accusations. I mean, let’s…for instance, we were on a show three days ago and the Mayor of Cape Town, Geordin Hill-Lewis, makes a very serious allegation on the show where he says that, he says,
Chris Steyn (06:36.949)
I was gonna ask you.
Gayton (06:42.51)
Gayton McKenzie’s Mayor in TWK went to watch the Rugby World Cup on taxpayers’ money. I said to him, if that is the truth, I will resign from politics on the stage. He insisted this is the truth. I said, if that’s the truth, then I have no business being in politics. I said, show me the pictures. He says, I’ve got pictures. And then he whips out the picture of an ANC male and that lady is a female, doesn’t even have a passport, never been out of the country. Now, this is the type of things I deal with on a daily basis.
The audience, when they heard him say that, I could hear them gasping like, oh, going to watch the Rugby World Cup. They lied blatantly. And instead of apologising, because the Mayor is called Mary Liebenberg, but she’s never been out of the country. Now they insist, yeah, if the ANC does something, you must also be guilty of it. I’m like, come on, since when are we guilty for the sins of the…which means when they went coalition with EFF in 2016, so which means all the sins of EFF must be visited upon the DA. That’s not fair and that’s not right. And that’s stupid, actually.
So I’m just saying that the olive branch, to answer your question, yes, I extended the olive branch because I do think that the Western Cape will not be best served with the ANC coming back. I honestly think, I don’t think much of the DA, but I think they’re better than the ANC. And everybody else except the people the DA speaks to is not aware that there’s going to be a coalition in the Western Cape. And I just thought that, you know, if we bring together the DA and the PA and all these parties, we can work together. And that’s why, against all advice, I extended the olive branch. And they then answered that by insulting me, by taking adverts out, by starting a podcast called Let’s tell you about how bad the PA is, where they take a lot of dumb Coloureds and they lump them all in that podcast. And the people want the olive branch. And you know the people did because they’re excited after seeing on BizNews the olive branch, and the people started insulting them. Then they closed the accounts. They locked the accounts so people couldn’t comment anymore because it was just an avalanche of messages coming through like, guys, come on, we need peace. So I want to say on your show that everything has an expiry date. My olive branch has expired. It’s war. It’s full-out war. We are not playing. They can keep on lying, you know, with those people. It doesn’t hurt you until it kills you. They are persisting with their arrogance. What they’re doing to the voter in the Western Cape that has diligently kept them in power, they being… I think they’re doing them such a great injustice by the arrogance of the current leadership of the DA.
Because they know they’re going to lose power. If they didn’t lose power, why are they sending me, my children, my family, and everybody who lives in Cape Town, everyday SMSes not to vote for Gayton? Who does that? They’re sending me, I get text messages, don’t vote for Gayton. That’s the mighty DA. They’ve done such a good job. Why are they going to those levels? They give out, Alan Winde gave out flyers to every house at a by-election that I’m a drug dealer.
And the people that got the by-elections, it was the biggest joke for them. Even the people that said, I wanted to vote for them, but this tactics, I’m voting for you now. So they must keep on insulting me. They must keep on making me famous. There’s people that didn’t know who Gayton McKenzie was in the Western Cape. They know now. They got a marketing company there that’s very stupid, but it’s really helping us. So we’re not complaining. Every advert they take out, every flyer they give, every text message is saying…people are curious, who’s this Gayton Mackenzie? And that’s why we see our numbers are going up. So as far as peace between us and the DA, it ain’t gonna happen.
Chris Steyn (10:49.749)
Gayton, how many wards are you holding in the Western Cape by now?
Gayton (10:54.254)
We, I think we are now on 29 in the Western Cape. We’re 29, sorry, in the whole of Western Cape. I think we are on 29, 29 councilors in the Western Cape. And I speak under correction. I don’t have the exact figure, but in the City of Cape Town, we’ve got four. That is, sorry, we’ve got five in the City of Cape Town. In the Western Cape, I think it’s around 29. And we’ve been winning 80% of the by-elections that we’ve partook in. And the PA has never seen such phenomenal growth like we’ve seen in the past two years since the election. We have grown from strength to strength.
And I am the one person that’s made 10 predictions on your show. Not one of them were wrong. I remember they were saying, when I said the ANC is going to go…be under 40 percent, everybody was laughing at me. The very same people are now doing the same prediction. I’m not saying I’m always right, but there are certain things that are. If I’m wrong, I’m not so off the mark. I’m saying to you that the Western Cape, I don’t think the Democratic Alliance will reach 35 per cent in the Western Cape. I’m telling you, and it’s not because of Gayton, I’m not the one, and everybody wrongly gives me the credit. The issue you’re sitting with is that they have only serviced the white side of the mountain and they’ve ignored the black and Coloured side of the mountain. And that is nothing to do with me. And I think that is their undoing. That’s why the people are angry with them. And they’re giving me too much credit. They’re giving me too much credit.
And mainly your listeners. I don’t know if they like to listen to me, but I can see how much they hate me in the comment sections. Your listeners need to understand. They can be told anything by the DA. They can be told anything. They will just believe it. These people are liars. These people are holding on to power. These people are not telling you that the boat is sinking. These people are not being honest with you as a voter. They are not good for race relations because a lot of Coloured and black people start hating the white people in the Western Cape.
Gayton (13:17.454)
And the white people are being unfairly hated in the Western Cape because white people in the Western Cape think what the service they get, they think the DA gives that service all round. And now a lot of my friends are hating the whites and people following you simply because they think it is the white people which is totally untrue. It is the DA that gives good service to the whites and the whites are under the impression that the DA gives equally good service to other areas. Nothing. Nada. They do nothing in other areas. All they talk about is Knysna and Knysna and no water. There’s no water in Franschoek. But you never see that, you never hear about that. Go see how the people live in Khayelitsha. Go see how backyard dwellers stay in our communities. But then the DA, the horses in Constantia, they are grazing, they got land to graze. But our people don’t even have a place to build a house. And you want the DA to remain in power. The DA is finished in the Western Cape and they can deny that all they like.
Two questions, anybody that thinks I’m lying. All right, three questions. Since when, and let’s not be emotional about issues. Answer these three questions for me. This one question for me. Since when has the mighty DA not taken part in by-elections in the Western Cape? This is their territory. That’s the one question. Since when in the history of the DA…they didn’t partake in Clanwilliam? They didn’t partake in Dysselsdorp. Now answer that question. When they had to face us in Kensington last year, they said, no, there was an oversight. Somebody didn’t fill in the form. And I didn’t believe that, but I had to accept that. Now this time, who didn’t fill in the forms? Both by elections, you guys didn’t partake. Since when do you need other parties to prop you up in order to beat the PA?
Your strongest area is Swartland. The DA’s never lost. We beat them there. So you can persist with your lie. But my olive branch is over. It’s war now. It’s war. We are coming for the DA. We’ve been restraining ourselves, holding back, trying to make peace. And a lot of white people, a lot of white people make the mistake of it’s bordering on racism, where they go like, now you must just make peace with the DA. But they never say to the DA you must make peace with the PA. Since who gave them the right to give me instructions? Eks ’n anner Coloured, I don’t get instructions from white people to tell me what to do, what not to do. If you tell your gardener what to do, you won’t tell me. And then they get angry when you stand up for yourself. They never tell the DA, you must work with the PA, but they tell me all the time, as if they are funding me. As if some of them think…Rob, you must tell him as if…Rob is not funding me. I don’t take money from Rob. Rob Hersov wanted to give me money. I refused. He wanted to fund our whole election. I refused because I said to him, you are my friend. Let’s keep it at friendship level because I don’t agree with a lot of Rob’s views – and I agree with a lot of his views economically, but I don’t agree with some of the things he says. And I love Rob. He’s my friend. I said to him, Rob, I appreciate that you want to fund me. And he’s not the only one, Rob. A string of guys wanted to give us money and I said no. And I said, no, my friends will help. We are fine.
So all I’m saying is that the same pressure you put on me, you must also put on the madam that side. But people come around like, you have to work with the DA. You have to. But they never tell the DA the same. It’s some type of Baaskap mentality, which I can never tolerate. Not me. Ek BaizaNie, I’m from the PA.
Gayton (17:06.414)
You ask anybody, sorry can I just say this, Corné Mulder, Corné Mulder, and any smart man, if you ask any smart, honest man, you can ask a guy like Neil De Beer, he’s honest. You can ask a guy like Corné, he’s honest. You ask them one question, you ask them, you think the DA is gonna keep the Western Cape? They say, they will tell you never. And I’m saying to you, because they’re honest. Now, they lie to people, particularly your listeners. They lied to them, your viewers. Now we’re gonna make it. They’re lying, they’re not gonna make it. And it’s not because of Gayton. I’m not the danger for them. They think I’m the danger. The danger is the non-service delivery.
Chris Steyn (17:56.897)
Gayton, with the way things are going, how do you think the national election outcome is going to shape up?
Gayton (18:04.782)
I think, yeah, what is already been a fact? I think the MK party, let’s start with MK. I think they’re making strategic blunders, MK with the in fighting amongst them. It’s too close to the election to have that type of fights. It’s too close to the election and they’re having a lot of fights. I think ActionSA is on a roll. Freedom Front Plus is on a big roll. I also think that EFF will maintain, although they are busy imploding in the Limpopo. And now if you ask me, what do I think the ANC is going to get? I’m still standing that they’re going to get between 35 and 37 percent. I think EFF might lose, might go to nine percent. I do think the PA stands a chance between seven and nine percent.
But the main thing is that the DA, I look at the DA around 16%. I think the DA is going to get 16%. I think they’re going to remain the second largest party at 16%. But I do think that the DA will not make, the DA will not, the Moonshot Pact will not make it. The Moonshot Pact will not make – let me open here – The Moonshot Pact will not make the…The Moonshot Pact will not make 40% put together. They will not make 40%. That’s my estimate.
Chris Steyn (19:42.221)
So who’s going to go into coalition with whom then? Do you think?
Gayton (19:45.07)
Here’s my issue. For me, it is very simple. I think that the biggest mistake we’re having here is that what we need to avoid is that the EFF and the ANC must not be able to, must not get enough to form a coalition. Simply because the EFF is much forceful and much stronger than the ANC in terms of getting the way.
And I believe I will go with anybody in the coalition, even if it’s the ANC, even if it’s the DA, as long as property rights are protected. I’m very high on property rights. Simply because I know if you don’t have property rights, you don’t have a country left. And the talk I hear in the corridor, and people don’t know that the ANC has had a private meeting with me, or with the PA, not with me, with the PA, where they asked us to have a pre-coalition agreement with some of the members, and I said no.
But then you read the DA tells everybody we are lackeys of the ANC. We could have taken that for a minister’s position. But we said no. The ANC makes this type of deal. That’s why you see people from other parties holding ministerial posts in the ANC. And we said no, we don’t want that. We will take our chances with the election and after the results we will then decide who we’re going with.
So I just think that South Africa needs to be looking at a different game. The match you need to look at is not the big guys. You need to look at the EFF and the PA. And Malema has picked it up. That’s why he’s going to all my areas that I have won wards. He went to Eldorado Park. He went to Reiger Park. He went back to Reiger Park again. Because Malema understand politics. Malema understand that the fight is between the PA and the EFF. Hence, Malema can go anywhere, but he goes to all the places where have won wards in the past two weeks.
Malema speaks about me more than he speaks about any other politician. He’s calling me a drug dealer. He’s calling me all those types of stuff. He’s calling me every name under the sun because Malema understand that this election is between me and him, EFF and PA. So I’m saying that if you are a white person, it’s no longer time to vote for your normal parties you’re voting for. Let’s keep Malema out. I’m the only guy that can stand up to that fool. I’m the only one that can stand up to that mafia. South Africa doesn’t deserve a guy like Malema.
Gayton (22:12.622)
So you have three votes, at least pay me two so I can stop die bliksempie. He’s the menace to our political establishment in this country or tradition.
Chris Steyn (22:21.357)
Gayton.
Chris Steyn (22:30.561)
May I change the subject, Gayton, I see you’ve been meeting with the gangs in Malmesbury to try and bring peace there. How is it going?
Gayton (22:38.51)
Well, you know, the problem was that I’ve been doing that for most of my life, making peace between gangs. Now people say, ah, they’re going to start fighting again. Of course, they’re going to start fighting again. But you see, a one-day peace means a lot to our people, or a one-week peace or a one-month peace means a lot to the people that lives there. The children couldn’t even go to school. There’s no peace. This is now day six of the peace. The peace is holding. I’m not going to come on your show and say it’s going to be a forever peace because the circumstances that led to, that leads to gangsterism is still there. You know, once again, I heard the Mayor said that himself, of Cape Town, people think gangsterism is a policing issue only. Gangsterism is a socioeconomic issue. I have young boys in the PA that, they ask me, what do you do for a living? He tells me straight up, I’m selling drugs. I said, do you wanna sell drugs? He says, no, I wanna get out. Would you take me out, Sir? But then I must give him a job. I must replace that income that a gang boss gives him. And once we don’t sort out that socioeconomic issue, we’re doomed to fail.
Gayton (23:48.334)
So for me, it’s simply a case of we need a new government in the Western Cape. We need…I don’t even think that, you know, the Western Cape is such a vast area and such a great province that we need not only to look in the Patriotic Alliance for people that will come and lead, we need to spread and get the best people possible, even if they are not PA members.
Chris Steyn (23:49.39)
Thank you.
Gayton (24:16.59)
We need to go out and get the best people to come and help us run the city. But it can’t be business as usual.
Chris Steyn (24:25.997)
Thank you. That was Gayton McKenzie, the President of the Patriotic Alliance, speaking to BizNews after two by-election victories. Thank you, Gayton. I’m Chris Steyn. Stay with me.
Gayton (24:36.91)
Salute, thank you Chris.
Read also:
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